Professor of philosophy at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary, William A. Dembski tells of his first-person experience with Todd Bentley and his healing ministry. At this point some of us don’t know whether to love or to hate Todd Bentley’s ministry. Maybe the following excerpts from professor Dembski’s article might be just what you’re looking for to help you decide:
On July 3, my wife, three children and I attended Bentley’s “impartation service” in Denton, Texas, north of Dallas. Why? We have twin 7-year-old boys, one of whom is autistic (largely nonverbal, still not fully toilet trained, serious developmental delays). Friends urged that we attend the meeting for his miraculous healing.
I don’t think anyone should question the professor’s clear intentions for going to Todd Bentley’s miraculous healing service.
Call us stubborn, but my wife and I are unimpressed with doctors who see our son’s condition as hopeless. We believe that God still heals and that His means of healing include conventional medicine, alternative medicine, prayer, fasting, love and, yes, miracles. In any case, we haven’t given up on our son’s recovery (we still remember the day when he was developmentally on track). So if God wanted to use Todd Bentley, we were open to it.
Again, the professor has no bone to pick.
As faith healers go, Bentley is unconventional. Exhibiting black shirt, baggy jeans, tattoos and piercings, he prefers grunge to Gucci. But his appearance wasn’t a problem for my wife or me. God in the Bible used many unconventional people. The problem for us was the manipulation, hype and agenda that seemed to pervade the meeting.
I believe Peter Kirk has been making this argument.
Finally, around 9 p.m. Bentley began to speak. He devoted much of his message to the visions he has received and the miracles he claims have happened in his ministry. Then, almost as an afterthought, he spent a few minutes preaching from the Bible (John 5). In fact, he admitted that he was having us open the Bible simply so that it couldn’t be said that he didn’t preach from the Bible. So much for reverencing the Scriptures.
Nowhere in Bentley’s message did I see an emphasis on the love and compassion of God — that healing is an expression of God’s goodness and care for humanity. Rather, the emphasis throughout was on power — the power to heal and be healed.
Do you think the professor’s observation is legitimate? Should he have gone there?
Bentley told stories of remarkable healings. In fact, he claims that in his ministry 30 people have now been raised from the dead. Are these stories credible? A common pattern in his accounts of healing was an absence of specificity. Bentley claims that one man, unembalmed, had been dead for 48 hours and was in a coffin. When the family gathered around at a funeral home, the man knocked from inside the coffin to be let out.
But what are the specifics? Who was this man? What’s his name? Where’s the death certificate? And why not parade the man at Bentley’s meetings? If I am ever raised from the dead through anyone’s ministry, you can be sure I’ll put in a guest appearance. Bentley claims that he is having a team investigate healings performed under his ministry and will soon go public with the evidence. I look forward to seeing it.
Again, I believe the professor has raised some important questions.
After preaching, Bentley took the offering. During the offering he asked “How much anointing do you want to receive?” Thus he linked the blessing we should receive with the amount of money we gave.
This is definitely cause for concern.
At this point, a friend who was with us urged that she and my wife take our son with autism down for prayer (I stayed with our other son and daughter). Over an hour later my son with autism was still not able to get to the main floor for prayer. Ushers twice prevented that from happening. They noted that he was not in a wheelchair. Wheelchair cases clearly had priority — presumably they provided better opportunities for the cameras, which filmed everything. They also invoked the fire marshals, who, they claimed, prohibited too many people on the floor of the arena. But earlier in the service, during the worship time, they had packed the floor with people singing and whooping it up.
Ok.
After midnight we were told that it would be an hour and a half before our son could get prayer. At that point, we got up and left. Yet the story doesn’t end there. When we got to the minivan, our other son remembered that he had left his Bible in the arena. When my wife went back to retrieve it, everybody, including Bentley, had suddenly cleared out. Staying an hour and a half would not have mattered.
Understandable?
Our son was refused prayer twice because he didn’t look the part, and he was told to wait still longer for a prayer that would never have been offered. And even those who looked the part seemed to look no better after Bentley’s prayer — the exodus from the arena of people bound in wheelchairs was poignant.
My son’s situation was not unique — a man with bone cancer and his wife traveled a long distance, were likewise refused prayer, and left in tears. People with needs were shortchanged. It seemed that power, prestige and money (in that order) were dominating motives behind the meeting. Minimal time was given to healing, though plenty was devoted to assaulting our senses with blaring insipid music and even to Bentley promoting and selling his own products (books and CDs).
Why were these people refused prayer that could have healed them? Wouldn’t their healing have provided a great opportunity to glorify God?
Something seems amiss…
TC, thanks for this. I’m not sure what argument you think I am making. I did say in a comment on that other post that “I don’t like Benny Hinn’s style or his approach to finances, but I do consider his ministry valid.” I prefer Todd’s style and his approach to finances, but I still have some reservations.
I agree there is some cause for concern in Dembski’s account. But I also find your presentation one-sided. I note one significant thing which you omit:
So Todd did pray for healing for Dembski’s son. I don’t know who told him his son could only be healed by a personal touch from Todd. Clearly he couldn’t personally pray for all the sick among about 7,000 people. He did offer to pray individually for cases in a certain category, apparently those in wheelchairs, but it is his right to choose who to pray for.
Dembski complains that “Minimal time was given to healing”. But he also notes that is was over an hour from when Todd started praying for the sick who came forward until he left. This is in addition to the time of general prayer. Well over an hour is hardly “Minimal time” in a five hour meeting, especially when this was billed as an “impartation service” and not as a healing meeting.
Even Jesus had to close his meetings and take a rest sometimes. You, TC, need to accept what Dembski seems to have accepted, that one man is not physically capable of praying individually for thousands of people in one night. He was probably too exhausted to continue for the extra hour and a half suggested by his stewards. Some kind of prioritisation had to be given. The preference for those in wheelchairs may seem arbitrary, but then so would drawing names out of a hat. Perhaps “first come, first served” would have been fairer, but there are genuine safety concerns with such a melee of people pressing to the front.
I am glad that Dembski took his family to this event. I’m sorry that his son was not immediately healed on this occasion. But maybe he will be healed gradually in answer to the general prayer. Or maybe God wants to heal him in another way or another place. Todd has never claimed that everyone who comes to his meetings is immediately healed. And the fault is not anyone’s lack of faith.
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I think you summed the facts about Todd Bentley’s ministry up in the following line:
“Something seems amiss…”
Indeed it does because something is amiss. Can you see our Lord Jesus denying someone access to healing simply because he/she did not “look the part” or because of “fire codes”? Of course not. If these people want healing they need to obey the Scriptures (Jms 5:13-16) and stop traveling around after these religious charlatans.
Sadly I have no doubt that men like Todd Bentley are taking advantage of sick and desperate people for profit. Remember what he said?
“he linked the blessing we should receive with the amount of money we gave”
That should have sent up all sorts of red flags.
I believe people like Todd Bentley are fulfilling the Scriptures:
“Many will follow their sensuality, and because of them the way of the truth will be maligned; and in their greed they will exploit you with false words; their judgment from long ago is not idle and their destruction is not asleep” -2Peter 2:2-3
Those warnings are just as true now as they were when pinned by Peter under inspiration of the Holy Spirit. May we all take them seriously.
Martin.
Peter, this is quote I’m referring to:
I was making the point from your quote that a miracle can be unprecedented.
Peter, I thought about including that in my excerpt but thought that the point was already made in the one I used. I was not trying to be misleading.
Dembski is the one who took issue with this.
Peter, I’ve never been this involved in these types of events until Todd Bentley. Yes, there’s Benny Hinn, but I’ve never really looked that deeply into his ministry.
Martin, are you seriously suggesting that Todd and his stewards should have ignored the fire codes, on the basis that there weren’t any in Jesus’ time?
If the professor believes that his sons autism is more than physical, I would suggest he learn about deliverance and do it himself. We can all use the authority and name of Jesus Christ to make demons flee.
I don’t know about him being in it for financial reasons, it doesn’t seem that way to me. I know he was just taken a break to spend time with the Lord and to seek him on the direction for the whole thing.
Most times I’ve watched him, Jesus is spoken about ALOT.
Stories like this do make me question, and as I’ve thought all along, if someone asks me is this from God, the Devil, or the flesh; my answer would be Yes!
“are you seriously suggesting that Todd and his stewards should have ignored the fire codes, on the basis that there weren’t any in Jesus’ time?”
==My point was not that there were fire codes in Jesus’ day or anything like that. My point was that the reasons given that the boy was not “seen” and “healed” were really sorry. Todd Bentley is just another “miracle healer”, another I’ve done all these things but I can’t provide one seconds worth of proof. His focus is on himself, his works, and what he claims he can do for the poor people who are dupped into giving him money. I don’t believe Todd Bentley has the gift of healing at all. If he did why does he not go into hospitals and nursing homes and do some real good instead of putting on shows and taking people’s money.
Martin.
Ferg said:
I like your take on things, but what do you really mean? You’re not coming through clearly.
Sorry TC. You’re right, I think I do come across unclear and I guess the reason that I do is because I am!!
I truly believe that God is doing amazing things in Florida, and myself and my wife where watching last week and we had a wonderful time in the presence of the Lord, after we watched the program and we sought the Lord, asking him to reveal himself to us like he is doing to some in Florida.
When I say it has aspects of the work of the devil, I believe that the enemy will exploit the weakness of men and use it for his gain. Manipulating and causing chaos and confusion. it’s what he loves to do. i’m sure there are aspects of this in the revival. there were aspects of this in Jesus ministry so I’m not sure we can write it off purely because the enemy could be using it.
I also believe that the flesh can be at work in it, we men can be filled with pride and the results aren’t good!
I hope that shows a bit of my view. I do worry that people are dismissing something that could be really effective.
One more thing if I may, physical miracles in some way don’t hugely effect me – what I think is incredible is if someone with a broken heart has it healed by the power of Jesus; that is a true miracle. If people go to the revival and leave with a renewed zeal for Jesus whether they have been healed or not; that would be an answer to prayer.
Ferg, thanks for the clarification. Do you consider the healing ministry of Todd Bentley legitimate and not just the revival aspect?
Very good question. One that I wish I could answer, but also one that I can’t answer.
I am a believer in the ministry of deliverance and I have no doubt that people are being set free. I also think that every one of us can use the power of the holy spirit indwelling in us in the name of Jesus. The problem is that us western christians don’t really believe that the enemy is actually at work. Especially those of a reformed tradition (forgive me if this is an unfair comment to make, it is an observation I have made that I could be wrong in). I think some, definitely NOT all, infirmities are from demons and can be cast out and then I also know that Jesus can also just plain heal people of physical illnesses.
Myself and my friend prayed over his legs two weeks ago. He couldn’t run because they had been so painful for the last 4 years. He was healed. It was amazing. He has been running everyday since.
A lot of times people don’t get healed, but sometimes that’s the way it goes. we don’t know why and I wonder why not, but I don’t doubt the healing power of God. And I don’t think God is punishing people bu leaving them with their affliction. sometimes there’s much more going on than we know.
I think I went off topic – is Bentley’s healing ministry legit; I hope so and I pray so. I was very cynical when I first saw it but I was convicted that I hadn’t even thought to pray for Todd & his team or those attending. That’s what I do now. I’m trying to discern is it legit, but above all I’m trying to cover it in prayer.
Peter, I posted this response to you on the other thread, but didn’t know if you read it. With TC’s permission, here it is:
Hi Peter:
I have read your post carefully and prayerfully, and offer the following comments for your consideration.
Peter wrote: “How do you know what God said to Todd?”
Bud’s comments: From Todd Bentley’s own worded claims. Please re-read the above word-for-word transcript where Bentley clearly told Roger, “I had to be obedient to the Lord, sir.”
Peter wrote: “Are you calling Todd a liar?”
Bud’s comments: Since kneeing, kicking, slapping, etc. are not the methods God uses to heal, God calls Todd Bentley a liar:
“Then the LORD said to me, ‘The prophets are prophesying falsehood in My name I have neither sent them nor commanded them nor spoken to them; they are prophesying to you a false vision, divination, futility and the deception of their own minds’” (Jeremiah 14:14).
Peter wrote: “You can say if you like that Todd might have been mistaken. But you have no right to make this kind of definite statement that God did not do something when you have no evidence either way.”
Bud’s comments: A typo in an article is a mistake. Turning off the freeway onto a wrong exit is a mistake. What Todd Bentley is doing in the name of “God” is not a mistake, but sin. I and others have tried to contact him, but he makes excuses and refuses to speak with us.
Concerning the second part of your post, Todd Bentley’s Fresh Fire Ministries “Statement of Faith” reads:
“We recognize that God is continually restoring truth and light to His Church. Therefore, we place no limit on further revelation; however, each must be substantiated according to the Scriptures” (#12, Further Revelation,
http://www.freshfire.ca/index.php?Id=106&pid=8 ).
By his own admission, Todd Bentley places “no limit on further revelation,” but does state that each revelation “must be substantiated according to the Scriptures.”
When someone claims a revelation from God, are Christians to simply accept it or test it by God’s word? Christians are commanded by Scripture to test all things by what God has already said (1 Thessalonians 5:21-22). Another Scriptural command is 1 John 4:1:
“Beloved, do not believe every spirit, but test the spirits to see whether they are from God, because many false prophets have gone out into the world.”
“To the law and to the testimony: if they speak not according to this word, it is because there is no light in them” (Isaiah 8:20).
As a Christian who loves the Lord and the truth of His word, I am commanded to share the truth in love and defend the faith without compromise (Jude 3). When tested by Scripture, Todd Bentley is a false teacher, and God gives me the right to say it.
Peter wrote: “God is not limited to doing only what he did in the Bible.”
Bud’s comments: Says who? God is the creator and sustainer of the universe. Nothing happens without His knowledge. He does not change or lie (Malachi 3:6; Numbers 23:19). And, while God can do anything He desires, He will not violate His word:
“Sanctify them in the truth; Your word is truth” (John 17:17).
“All Scripture is inspired by God and profitable for teaching, for reproof, for correction, for training in righteousness; so that the man of God may be adequate, equipped for every good work” (2 Timothy 3:16-17).
“For the word of God is living and active and sharper than any two-edged sword, and piercing as far as the division of soul and spirit, of both joints and marrow, and able to judge the thoughts and intentions of the heart” (Hebrews 4:12).
“Every word of God is tested; He is a shield to those who take refuge in Him. Do not add to His words or He will reprove you, and you will be proved a liar” (Proverbs 30:5-6).
Thus, since God’s word is true, all modern-day prophecies, revelations, and teachings must be tested by Scripture.
Peter wrote: “Anyway, in the Bible he commanded lots of people to kill lots of others. That does of course raise all kinds of questions about God.”
Bud’s comments: What does that have to do with the subject at hand? Nevertheless, God is not a heartless mass-murderer. There is a big difference between merciless killing and righteous judgement. God is in complete control of everything within the entire universe–including earth and those who inhabit it:
“For My thoughts are not your thoughts, nor are your ways My ways,” declares the LORD. For as the heavens are higher than the earth, so are My ways higher than your ways and My thoughts than your thoughts” (Isaiah 55:8-9).
“Oh, the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! How unsearchable are His judgments and unfathomable His ways!” (Romans 11:33).
Concerning the second part of your post, answers to questions about God can be found within the pages of His word. All we have to do is search and study.
Peter wrote: “But why on earth should God not command Todd to do something which didn’t hurt the subject and brought him at least partial healing?”
Bud’s comments: With all of the above in mind, if you will please read the following articles carefully and prayerfully, they will help answer your question:
http://www.christianresearchservice.com/ToddBentley1.htm
http://www.christianresearchservice.com/ToddBentley3.htm
Peter wrote: Or are you dictating to God that he is only allowed to do things now which he did before in the Bible, that the God who said ‘See, I am doing a new thing!’ (Isaiah 43:19) is no longer allowed to do new things?”
Bud’s comments: No one, including myself, dictates to God what He should and should’t do.
Isaiah 43:19 reads: “Behold, I will do something new, now it will spring forth; will you not be aware of it? I will even make a roadway in the wilderness, rivers in the desert.”
It is vital to read and study Scripture in context, instead of picking out a few words or sentences to fit one’s belief or teaching. The words, “Behold, I will do something new” are many times used by false teachers to fit their own agenda and “prove” that God will go beyond what He has already stated in His word.
A text of Scripture taken out of context becomes a pre-text. For example, did you know that the Bible plainly says, “There is no God”? It does! But when Psalm 53:1 is read in context, it says,
“The fool has said in his heart, ‘There is no God,’ they are corrupt, and have committed abominable injustice; there is no one who does good.”
Therefore, when read in context with the whole chapter, Isaiah 43:19 is a promise from God to deliver the children of Israel out of Babylon and give them a safe passage into the wilderness.
God doesn’t scratch his head in confusion or change His mind or contradict His word. And it is fruitless to say otherwise.
Cultic doctrines and heresies are formed by taking Scripture of context. Read the verses along with the chapters to understand the Book. The cults and heretics steer people away from the truths in God’s word and into the arms of a counterfeit “Jesus, gospel, and spirit” (Galatians 1:6-9; 2 Corinthians 11:3-4). Cultic and heretical teachings have not the ability to save, sanctify, or redeem the sinner.
Peter wrote: “Chris, it is worth bearing in mind that healing is not always instantaneous. Even Jesus took two goes to heal one blind man.”
Bud’s comments: I don’t understand the second part of your post, but while your comment is addressed to Chris, please allow me to comment on Jesus and healing. While there are many, many examples, Matthew 15:30-31 clearly teaches:
“And large crowds came to Him, bringing with them those who were lame, crippled, blind, mute, and many others, and they laid them down at His feet; and He healed them. So the crowd marveled as they saw the mute speaking, the crippled restored, and the lame walking, and the blind seeing; and they glorified the God of Israel” (Matthew 15:30-31).
When Jesus Christ healed someone, He didn’t leave “glasses” on their face, or “prosthetics” on their amputated legs, or a “glass eye” in its eye-socket. When Jesus healed the crippled they did not struggle for balance or walk away limping. Jesus did not use “catchers.” Jesus did nothing half-way, and did not make excuses or tell people “It might be a few days, weeks, or months before your healing takes effect.”
And how are Christians to test someone who claims the ability to heal in the name of the Lord? The Bible. It is chock-full of examples. Yet, the sick and dying are flocking to faith healers all over the world, and they are leaving the “healing crusades” the same way they entered–sick and dying.
But other than healing, Jesus also raised people from the dead. In this video at http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pLv6C7b6m88 , Todd Bentley announced a “testimony” of the “13th resurrection from the dead!” as a result of the Florida revival. The resurrection, according to Bentley, took place at a funeral home.
Long story short, the dead-man “sat up in the coffin praising God and the Reverend Todd Bentley!”
I became curious after watching the video, called numerous funeral homes, spoke to officials, and asked questions pertaining to a dead-man being raised to life from his coffin. Without exception, they all said it hasn’t happened. Also, a few of the officials said that if a dead man had actually been raised to life from a coffin, they would have known about it–nationwide.
Indeed, a dead-man raising to life from his coffin would make headlines worldwide–if it were true, that is.
Peter wrote: “Roger seems to be on the mend, although only time will tell. We should praise God for that and believe that he will complete the work he started, rather than trying to use the incompleteness of the immediate healing as a weapon to tear down a man of God.”
Bud’s comments: Again, I believe God heals. Roger, based on his testimony, appears to be sincere and in need of God’s healing. While we should pray for God’s will to be done in Roger’s life, let us not forget that Todd Bentley claims to have the gift of healing and that he claims to receive instructions from “God” and “Jesus” and the “Holy Spirit.”
However, if we do a side-by-side comparison with Todd Bentley’s “gift” with what we know Jesus and His Apostles did, Todd Bentley does not have the gift of healing.
Just because someone claims to be a prophet of God, teacher of God’s word, or a healer in the name of God doesn’t make it true. Since no one is immune from scrutiny or accountability, all things must be tested by what we already know what God has said.
And if we will study God’s word and use it for our ultimate and final authority, we will grow in discernment and won’t be fooled by the faith healers, false prophets and false teachers of our day.
In Christian love,
Bud
Ferg, I do not for once question God’s ability to heal. I need to make that clear. What I’m questioning is the validity of Todd Bentley’s ministry. Can God work through Todd Bentley’s ministry to heal? You bet he can!
Bud, no problem here. But I’m wondering, Why is it so looong?
TC: Thank you for posting my re-post. You asked, “Why is it so looong?” Well, I get long-winded sometimes, so you may want to think twice before talking to me over the phone.
I understand, and will keep future posts not so long-winded in the future. God bless, Bud
I get that from you tc. I appreciate the dialogue. Interesting stuff Bud! thanks.
Bud, I’m just joking. It can be as long as you wish. Just joking.
I appreciate your take on the matter, Ferg.
Ferg, you’re welcome.
TC, I know. No problem.
God bless,
Bud
Matthew 7:21-23, “Not everyone who says to me, ‘Lord, Lord,’ will enter the kingdom of heaven, but only he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven. Many will say to me on that day, ‘Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and in your name drive out demons and perform many miracles?’ Then I will tell them plainly, ‘I never knew you. Away from me, you evildoers!’
Peter,
In an earlier comment you said, “Even Jesus had to close his meetings and take a rest sometimes.” This is true, because Jesus was fully human, he did need rest. BUT, Jesus left the crowds and others tha needed to be healed and wanted miracles because he was on a mission to get to Jerusalem. He knew his identity, he knew his mission, and he knew the timing of his mission. So he kept moving, sometimes even seeming to blow people off or act rudely toward them. But Jesus knew where he was going. I wonder if Todd Bentley knows where he is going?