The prolific Joel Watts continues How Emergent was the Ancient Church? which actually got started on the Shepherds’ fellowship blog. It’s a worthwhile read.
Here’s Nathan Busenitz conclusion, after citing that famous passage from Justin Martyr’s First Apology to the Roman Emperor:
When I read Justin’s description I am encouraged, because those same things are found at our church too. Like the ancient church described here, we read the Scripture, listen to preaching, pray, sing, give, and regularly celebrate the Lord’s Table. And, of course, we also meet on Sundays.
I sometimes hear proponents of the emergent church arguing that we need to get back to the “ancient practices” of the church. But what “ancient practices” are they talking about? The mysticism of the late medieval period perhaps?
If you really want the ancient church, it doesn’t get any more ancient than the quote provided above. In fact, this description of an ancient church service (written by Justin Martyr around A.D. 150) is the earliest we have outside the New Testament.
So, how “emergent” was the ancient church? According to Justin Martyr, not much at all. For starters, a church that spends “as long as time permits” listening to the reading and preaching of God’s Word would hardly fit the Emergent Village paradigm. Yet, that is exactly what the church of Justin’s day did. They met each Sunday to fill their hearts with the truth of God’s Word. Then, having been overwhelmed with that truth, they responded by praying, singing, giving, and celebrating the Lord’s Table. Read full post…
According to Nathan, the Emergents call to return to the “ancient practices” of the ancient church is more like a call to “practices of the Medieval church.”
Here’s my question: by “ancient church,” do we mean the “church” as seen in the New Testament documents or from the second century and on, just before the Medieval church?
If from the second century and so on, Why do we need to concern ourselves?
Prolific? Aghast!
People assume that big Jesus had long hair that He was a hippy, and thus His followers were to. Not so much.
I guess prolific is a relative term here.
I’m afraid that too much assumptions are stifling the work of the Spirit in shaping the church throughout the ages.
If I didn’t know better, I would think that you are reading my draft posts on this subject.
They say great minds think alike.
Indeed!
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I started to add thoughts but it turned into a post!
Surely we want to model ourselves on those earliest communities and be a people walking in the Spirit, praying continually, experientially aware of the grace of God, petitioning for one another constantly, sharing our possessions, where joy is an imperative and tongues build up the believer and the whole body of believers when orderly and there is interpretation, where each member has equal status in Christ and honours its weaker parts – forget the insistence on Sunday alone! It’s not enough. Give us more Lord!
Rachel: I’m with you all the way, even on the everyday deal and not just Sunday.
But what about the burning of candles, incense, and so on?
Yes, TC, I do not think that I really understand where any of that comes from, only that I feel certain that if it helps people to connect with the Spirit of God, then it must be okay.
Just a personal reflection, on Sunday at my creative prayer service, I had the strangest time when I suddenly seemed to become overly conscious of the black and floaty white drapes and the candles in front of me, and it quite disconnected me from God. I wanted to leave quite desperately and just go somewhere plain and uncluttered…but anyway that’s perhaps just all a part of my own journey.
I visited a church a few weeks ago where there was a wooden Jesus at the alter and I felt similar. It’s all quite personal but I am yet to discover whether I can really meet with God in high Anglo-catholic spirituality – I’m trying to be open.
Yes, TC, I do not think that I really understand where any of that comes from, only that I feel certain that if it helps people to connect with the Spirit of God, then it must be okay.
Rachel: how much these things “help” us to connect with the Spirit of God is questionable. I would suspect that the spiritual disciplines of simple prayer, the study of the word, and so on should be enough.
We may stifle what the Spirit wants to do in our lives through disobedience. But I don’t see lighting a candle as a way to get back on track. Simple obedience will do the trick.
Just a personal reflection, on Sunday at my creative prayer service, I had the strangest time when I suddenly seemed to become overly conscious of the black and floaty white drapes and the candles in front of me, and it quite disconnected me from God. I wanted to leave quite desperately and just go somewhere plain and uncluttered…but anyway that’s perhaps just all a part of my own journey.
Then it becomes an individual indulgence, per your experience. But I would very much want to extend tha grace of letting others be.
But when McLaren and others are charing the rest of others with “forgetting” these “ancient practices,” I’m afraid not much grace is being extended (Rom. 14-15), since we’re not told to light candles to the glory of God.
I visited a church a few weeks ago where there was a wooden Jesus at the alter and I felt similar. It’s all quite personal but I am yet to discover whether I can really meet with God in high Anglo-catholic spirituality – I’m trying to be open.
I would have been uncomfortable too.
I very much understand myself to be an evangelical charismatic or maybe a charismatic evangelical but I am also aware that there are many unlike me from whom I can learn so long as it is Jesus’ teachings I seek under the counsel of the Spirit and by the grace of God.
You have spoken for me as well.
T.C., I have posted a second to last post on this (Tertullian) subject as well. I’ll do the final one tomorrow.
Joel: that passage from Tertullian is great. It does shed more light on this whole debacle. Did Mr. McLaren read it?
I doubt it. Neither, it seems did he read Justin or Acts.
I think people have this idealized view of early Christianity, but Tertullian was writing in a time of persecution, as was Justin. They needed their structure, and their corporateness.
I view the use of church history as a hermeneutical device as suspect.
Yes, persecution abounded. At any rate, that corporateness is our badge of honor, per Jesus’ words.